From the original SynthMaker forum (2004–2014), with its members’ names and dates.
Tom7777 ·
Pitch based oscs, Stream switch (last used/flow type things) Stream sample and hold, A random osc, Multi point osc, Multi point waveshaper, Standard waveshaper, Multi point ADSR,
Edit -
Sine 2 square convertor, Sample and hold, Frequency 2 Pitch, Various Eq's, Low shelf, High Shelf, Peak Eq,
fritzman ·
Cool suggestions Dan!
I would like to see some sequencer basics. Something that one could put together simply to make a custom step sequencer and such.
Best wishes, FRitz
skOre ·
could you specify ?
rl ·
I don't want to start another discussion here, but to support "midlevel" sequencing modules, SM needs some more low-level stuff - e.g. saving VST data as chunks (or do you want to save note and controller data using a couple of hundrets or thousands VST float parameters?) There should be a way to select midi out for external midi devices when used as a VST), a midi data recording mode, SYS-EX support for external midi-devices, more interaction with VST host (VSTTimeInfo, canDo's and such)
If I were a newbe I would like to see the typical building blocks of modular synthesizers: oscillators, wavetable oscillators ring-, phase-, frequency modulation some filter models (1-2-3-pole) a simple formant filter e.g. built from 4 bandpass filters adsr generators (slope, loop) waveshaper, saturator, efx,....
A GUI WIDGET SET: tabbed panes, scrollbar, buttons, menus.. (working myself on such stuff)
lanrosta ·
I'm with rl on this one too. I want the low level stuff to be done. It is really hindering the ability to create plugins that are beefy...especially MIDI only VST's. I want to see the VST Preset manager be able to extract and add presets in SM, etc. I wanna see SysEx coming in and out of SM. MIDI I/O selections, et al.
This has been my main problem with SM is this lack of low level modules that address the functional VST architecture.
My 2 cents on that one.
angstrom ·
one thing I would like is an ADSR that accepts trigger, as some envelopes need to be not triggered on keydown. A trigger (or gate) based ADSR would give more flexibility in construction and performance.
An ADSR with graduated slope variations like RL said. (lin to exp on a slider?)
An additive oscillator(s) 8 op, 16 op , 32 op sines in one osc, with volume modulation inputs for each op (!)
A multi-osc with 3 modulation Float inputs, which are smoothed and converted to poly streams within the module. This modulation of the osc frequency recently tripped me up , so I guess other newbs will get the same confusion. Give them an easy green data modulate-able oscilator.
Some simple graph / envelope / block / time based modulation graphs to plug into the filters. An example would be this ugly beast , but a better one might be the ones in absynth. Obviously that is extreme - but some implementation would help take the 'early learning' synths out of the outdated ADSR based past and into the DSP present.
Shifrin ·
angstrom wrote: An ADSR with graduated slope variations like RL said. (lin to exp on a slider?)
Well I don't know what malc/jorge/stefan or anyone else has/is doing - but I've almost done this now (AHDSR), indeed I already have an AHD envelope with variable slopes for Attack and Decay stages. It's quite CPU efficient too!
Also I am busy building a graphic AHDSR envelope along the lines of the Absynth one you posted a picture of - so handles to set AHDSR and little nodes to drag->alter shape of the A, D & R stages. I'm just a little pressed for time at the moment - but hopefully will be finished soon 😉
Shif.
skOre ·
Started on flexible envelopes, yet made this before to check if synthmaker could handle such a thing yet. Apparently it has its problems with this type of thing. Will start on the envelope soon, as I think that this on the other hand could work quite well.
Shifrin ·
Shifrin wrote: I already have an AHD envelope with variable slopes for Attack and Decay stages. It's quite CPU efficient too!
Posted it now 🙂
Simple 'Curvey'AHD envelope...
Shif.
rl ·
looks like there is an amount of stuff already cooking in lotsa secret laboratories. So maybe it's more a matter of organizing the available work instead of building everything new.
angstrom wrote: An additive oscillator(s) 8 op, 16 op , 32 op sines in one osc, with volume modulation inputs for each op (!)
you mean something like that?:
The Sound Scientist ·
Hey skOre 😀 .. I have been hoping for months that the devs would make a timestretch / pitchshift mod.... I don't have the skill or know how to build a module like this... I would love if somebody could make this.. 😍 .. I think it would make a big difference in the way potential users perceive SM.. Maybe this is too hard for one to make??? Or, maybe I'm a little bit ahead of myself and we must achieve 24 bit capabilities first? There has been some chatter on this subject recently and if you're trying to build new mods this one is seriously needed. 😉 😀 🙂 .. Thanks for everything Much Love 😍 Peace and Science
angstrom ·
rl wrote: looks like there is an amount of stuff already cooking in lotsa secret laboratories. So maybe it's more a matter of organizing the available work instead of building everything new.
angstrom wrote: An additive oscillator(s) 8 op, 16 op , 32 op sines in one osc, with volume modulation inputs for each op (!)
you mean something like that?:
Yeah .. I have something that looks very similar - except it seems to eat a lot of CPU even with the oscillators unplugged (30%cpu on a 2.6 p4). I wondered if it was the loop for the bars. How does yours perform?
fritzman ·
skOre wrote: could you specify ?
OK,
I'm not into sequencer building so I'm not sure what exactly is needed. - Ideally I imagine it like having templates with sliders, knobs, buttons and LEDs. Then you could specify in the properties how many steps you want to have.
- It should be possible to rotate the start point. That sounds like a module that shifts some time info around. But it should also be seen in the sequencer. Like step 3 becomes step one and it's also visible like that.
- glide with speed per step and global - note length (why not graphically visible?) - shuffle - transpose in semitones and octaves - loop start and loop end - abilities to reset all GUI elements of one row to default or one specified value
So far for now.
Best wishes, FRitz
skOre ·
Ok, will see what I can do about that fritzman. I guess you are coming from a SE-Background, right? So what you want is more or less a basic workaround approach to the thing?
The others: I think that what shows is, that there is a clear region for the mid level modules that are needed atm - its all about stream/audio signals.
started printing out the dspguide to soon get the knowledge for what you're asking for 🙂
Hope I can solve some of your problems. I also presume that some of them will soon be solved by the devs within the program.
cheers!
fritzman ·
skOre wrote: Ok, will see what I can do about that fritzman. I guess you are coming from a SE-Background, right? So what you want is more or less a basic workaround approach to the thing?
The others: I think that what shows is, that there is a clear region for the mid level modules that are needed atm - its all about stream/audio signals.
started printing out the dspguide to soon get the knowledge for what you're asking for 🙂
Hope I can solve some of your problems. I also presume that some of them will soon be solved by the devs within the program.
cheers!
Hi skOre,
I've got no SE background (only toyed a little with it) but I've got a strong Reaktor background. I don't understand what you meant with "more or less a basic workaround approach to the thing". What do you mean?
Best wishes, FRitz
lalo ·
some mid level
- a (very well) modulable interpolated delay line with feedback - audio buffers (play and record, save/load, good interpolation like spline) - midi buffers (play and record, save/load, quantize) - flexible ADSR (multisegment with slope and dynamic number of segments) - VST time from host and to host (with ppqs, time signature etc..) - a tap tempo module (basically a rhythm analisys tool to find the exact time intercourring between 2 events) - Stream Sample and Hold - Random Generator for stream and green types
some of the above i guess requires some more low leve components to be added or some present ones to be modified....
some of the above i have some work done (even with help from jorge, stefan, shifrin, sambean) 😍
will add more when i'll have ideas
skOre ·
fritzman wrote: I've got no SE background (only toyed a little with it) but I've got a strong Reaktor background. I don't understand what you meant with "more or less a basic workaround approach to the thing". What do you mean?
Ah, so Reaktor then... Just as you say that I remember you said something about working for NI 😉
Well, I was saying that you might be asking for a rudimentary solution that "does the job" rather then a full blown piano roll style sequencer that can do everything one could possibly ask for. Did I get that right?
fritzman ·
skOre wrote: fritzman wrote: I've got no SE background (only toyed a little with it) but I've got a strong Reaktor background. I don't understand what you meant with "more or less a basic workaround approach to the thing". What do you mean?
Ah, so Reaktor then... Just as you say that I remember you said something about working for NI 😉
Well, I was saying that you might be asking for a rudimentary solution that "does the job" rather then a full blown piano roll style sequencer that can do everything one could possibly ask for. Did I get that right?
Hi skOre,
sorry, I missed this one here. My youngest son was born on last sunday so the last days were full of changes and special situations! 🙂
Your question: Yes, I really meant "only" a step sequencer, not a piano roll thingy. 😉
All the best, FRitz
sambean ·
Congratulations Fritz!
All the best..
😀 😀 😀
skOre ·
Yeah, Herzlichen Glückwunsch!
Shifrin ·
sambean wrote: Congratulations Fritz!
All the best..
😀 😀 😀
Indeed!!!
Shif.
fritzman ·
Thanx guys! Very nice of you! We have lots of fun with him. 😍 😍 😍 But it's also power consuming ... 😉
All the best, FRitz
oddson ·
My youngest son was born on last sunday
If the son born last sunday wasn't your youngest I'd be really impressed. 😉 As it is, congrats! 🙂
fritzman ·
oddson wrote: My youngest son was born on last sunday
If the son born last sunday wasn't your youngest I'd be really impressed. 😉 As it is, congrats! 🙂
Hi Oddson,
it means that eh, I'm eh, I mean I have eh, well, you know? 😉
Thanx a lot! 😀
All the best, FRitz
strav100 ·
Breakpoint Envelopes !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Please !!!!!!!!!!!!
AngularMomentum ·
An arpeggiator...would love to have that in SM.
stefan ·
AngularMomentum wrote: An arpeggiator...would love to have that in SM.
Yeah, we too. Hard to do a decent one with the current events system though, unless we implement it as a specific component, which then would be a "closed system". Which isn't quite what I think is a good solution. And it'd be quite a lot of work as well. I'd say that amount of work is better put into finalizing 1.0 and go on working on the next version (so that we can get the new events system in place some day 🙂).
AngularMomentum ·
Heheh, I do not care if it is closed or open, I use the CK phrase arp one in most of my SE synths and it's something I am missing in SM. Tough a arp would not be nessecary if one would have a good working pitch sequencer a la step LFO... 😉
stefan ·
AngularMomentum wrote: Heheh, I do not care if it is closed or open, I use the CK phrase arp one in most of my SE synths and it's something I am missing in SM. Tough a arp would not be nessecary if one would have a good working pitch sequencer a la step LFO... 😉
Hm. I must read that thread again. I've often had "step sequencer LFO's" as pitch sequencers 🙂 Will have a look at the thread in question!
edit: uhm. Not sure what thread I'm talking about...
What seems to be the issue? 🙂
AngularMomentum ·
Together with Leif I turned the step into a pitch LFO, it does not come up with new values when switching presets, just keeps playing the former...also the 12 note scaling was very hard to do and this is where leif helped me out. The example Pitch sequencer in the FM example has only 4 notes, and if I would change that to 12 notes, the scale is not correct or at least, not as I want it, and then no BPM. I sent Malc the schematic but he could not recreate the bug I am experiencing. If that would be working, I create about a 100 different prefab melody's for sure, making people forget there is such a thing as an arp...!
I turned the step LFO also into a groove sequencer adjusting the groove timing of all seq's in the schematic...swings very cool!! 🙂
stefan ·
Neat 🙂 Not sure I understand the issues with making the LFO having just 12 values and adding bpm sync to it though. I have a bpm synced step seq lfo in Nildon. Without swing though 🙂
oddson ·
stefan wrote: ... Not sure I understand the issues with making the LFO having just 12 values ...
Twelfth root of two... I helped get it in tune. I didn't work that long on it and don't know how good a job I did.
@Thomas... Do you want some help?
stefan ·
oddson wrote: stefan wrote: ... Not sure I understand the issues with making the LFO having just 12 values ...
Twelfth root of two... I helped get it in tune. I didn't work that long on it and don't know how good a job I did.
@Thomas... Do you want some help?
Why not just have it before a pitch2freq instead? Let it work directly on pitch instead of on frequency.
oddson ·
stefan wrote: ...Why not just have it before a pitch2freq instead? Let it work directly on pitch instead of on frequency.
Possibly because I'm none too bright. 😕 I don't recall why I did the math directly but Thomas was having trouble with it and I did something that worked. I really don't remember what or why.
stefan ·
oddson wrote: stefan wrote: ...Why not just have it before a pitch2freq instead? Let it work directly on pitch instead of on frequency.
Possibly because I'm none too bright. 😕 I don't recall why I did the math directly but Thomas was having trouble with it and I did something that worked. I really don't remember what or why.
Pfft, stop insinuating that you or Thomas is "none too bright". You guys rock and if you claim that you don't you'll piss me off 🙂
AngularMomentum ·
stefan wrote: oddson wrote: stefan wrote: ... Not sure I understand the issues with making the LFO having just 12 values ...
Twelfth root of two... I helped get it in tune. I didn't work that long on it and don't know how good a job I did.
@Thomas... Do you want some help?
Why not just have it before a pitch2freq instead? Let it work directly on pitch instead of on frequency.
I already did try that before and that did not work as I wanted it.
AngularMomentum ·
oddson wrote: stefan wrote: ... Not sure I understand the issues with making the LFO having just 12 values ...
Twelfth root of two... I helped get it in tune. I didn't work that long on it and don't know how good a job I did.
@Thomas... Do you want some help?
Yeah I definately do! You remember the pitch sliding down bug...still got that, but I think that will be gone as soon as it will remember what it should be doing when switching presets.
AngularMomentum ·
Woohoo, and just after asking help, connecting the after change from the VST parameter array to Leif's multiplier values module fromgraph input it works!!!!! Man this makes me happy!!!!!
AngularMomentum ·
Oh yeah, then SM crashed and can't seem to fix it again.... 🙁
Is it alright if I send the OSM to you, Leif?
oddson ·
Sure... I'm at this place called 'work' right now but I'll look at it tonight... which will be morning for you. 😉
(We probably shouldn't hijack a sticky... sorry all!) 😇
AngularMomentum ·
LOL...I get an allergic reaction reading about that place called.... *sneezes*
Oops, hijacking a sticky eh? I'll shut up now before ending up in guantanamo bay....
AngularMomentum ·
I tried a couple of times to implement pitch bend into my projects. It would be nice to have it prefab in the Midi to Poly (the one with the portamento)...I tried the Unkargherth one posted on the forum but that did not work for me.
stefan ·
AngularMomentum wrote: I tried a couple of times to implement pitch bend into my projects. It would be nice to have it prefab in the Midi to Poly (the one with the portamento)...I tried the Unkargherth one posted on the forum but that did not work for me.
Is it not enough to just take the output of the PBend, multiply with range (for instance 2.0 semitones) and divide that with 8192. Then add the result to the pitch? This will only apply to pitch then ofcourse, and not to the frequency output of the Midi to Poly converter.
It's also doable for the frequency output though, just needs a different set of maths and needs to result in a multiply of the frequency, unlike the addition to the pitch.
AngularMomentum ·
I think that is what Unk did, but it results in weird scratch noises instead of a nice pitch bend. I only want it to work on the frequency btw.
oddson ·
Hijacking this thread again? 😉
I'll knock something together for you when I get home.
If you want to DIY here's the math (untested):
Shifted Freq = ((PBend/8192)-1)*(2^(1/12)*SemiToneMax)*Freq
By pitch:
Pitch Shift = (((PBend/8192)-1)*SemiToneMax)+Pitch
stefan ·
oddson wrote: Hijacking this thread again? 😉
I'll knock something together for you when I get home.
If you want to DIY here's the math (untested):
Shifted Freq = ((PBend/8192)-1)*(2^(1/12)*SemiToneMax)*Freq
By pitch:
Pitch Shift = (((PBend/8192)-1)*SemiToneMax)+Pitch
Shouldn't that be: Shifted Freq = 2^( ((PBend/8192) - 1) * SemiToneMax / 12) * Freq
? So that the PBend is part of the pitch2freq conversion, so to speak.
oddson ·
I haven't sorted out that you're right but have determined that I am not 😊
But now I'm thinking it should be:
((2^(1/12))^(SemiToneMax*((PBend/8192)-1)) * Freq
Not sure if that's the same thing 😕
All of this is based on the assumption it would be best to calc this in green and apply it to the Frequency value with a single stream multiplication instead of using the Pitch to Frequency stream converter.
stefan ·
oddson wrote: I haven't sorted out that you're right but have determined that I am not 😊
But now I'm thinking it should be:
((2^(1/12))^(SemiToneMax*((PBend/8192)-1)) * Freq
Not sure if that's the same thing 😕
All of this is based on the assumption it would be best to calc this in green and apply it to the Frequency value with a single stream multiplication instead of using the Pitch to Frequency stream converter.
a^b^c == a^(b*c) 😈
oddson ·
Yeah... OK.
I just knew the twelth-root-two should be able to be used as a constant.
1.0594630943592952645618252949463
I think I need a math refresher course! 😕
(so now look who's hijacked this thread 😈 )
dreamkeeper ·
lol - the math isn't THAT hard, is it? But there's another problem:
Many controllers do not send pitchbend data with full resolution, often the values are only -127..127. So there needs to be a smoother to prevent zipper noise.
Now, I tried that but had to realize, that for the frequency output the smoother will act as an pitch envelope and cause a noticeable attack - it seems that every note starts at 0Hz. I have no idea how to get around this. With pitch it works fine though, because the values are simply added and not multiplied.
werner
oddson ·
As Malibu Stacy says "Math is hard..."
The dezipper seems to be working fine for me... I've updated Unk's old file and posted on that thread:
New PitchBend Module Simple Sample
AngularMomentum ·
Many thanks Leif!!! Just added it to the addtable and it works perfect! 😀
Josh ·
What happened to unk anyways. Haven't seen him around on the forum for ages.
BasherT ·
Sorry to bring the thread back to where it started but I think we need a module that enables a numeric value to be displayed when a knob is turned or a slider is moved.
stefan ·
BasherT wrote: Sorry to bring the thread back to where it started but I think we need a module that enables a numeric value to be displayed when a knob is turned or a slider is moved.
Will force one in there 🙂
Wrote something here? To have a post removed or your name hidden, write to [email protected].
SynthMaker