From the original SynthMaker forum (2004–2014), with its members’ names and dates.
mshilarious ·
I am frustrated . . . by host DAW apps. They are all bloatware, highly "customizable", but never seems to be the custom features I want or need. Just last night I decided to abandon the latest version of a well-regarded program to go two versions back to where most (but not all) things worked and didn't get in my way.
I do audio analysis moreso than production, and I've already written several custom tools with the features I need for analysis, but of course they run as VSTs inside a host rather than as native features, which is a serious limitation.
So I have the concept of moving entirely to an SM .exe for all analysis, but having never deeply studied SM's functionality as far as routing and .wav load/save, what problems am I going to cause myself? Let's say for this discussion I don't need MIDI (I'm aware of those issues), and I don't need more than 8 I/O or active .wavs. Essentially, an 8-track recorder hardwired to all of the custom analysis I have already written?
infuzion ·
mshilarious wrote: I do audio analysis moreso than production, and I've already written several custom tools with the features I need for analysis, but of course they run as VSTs inside a host rather than as native features, which is a serious limitation.
VSTs inside hosts is not a limitation IMHO, it is a feature, since you can take those VSTs & use them in any host.
Seems Wavelab would be a good choice, or Sound Forge. I'm not so certain if SM is best for more than 2 tracks at a time for perhaps an entire song. It has to load the entire WAV into memory, not so certain memory stability, etc.
mshilarious ·
I have WL5 and WL7. I like the environment of 5, but it lacks some features and some stuff doesn't work right which was fixed by 7. The problem is 7 is an ergonomic disaster, so I still am using 5, and even 7 still doesn't do everything I need.
Again, I'm not mixing songs as much as recording a bunch of data that is mostly transitory (usually does not get saved). Example, let's say I need a given test signal--in WL, I have to go Tools/Audio Signal Generator and go through those menus and get a resulting .wav. In SM, I can simply create a trigger button and a few parameters that starts an oscillator. Of course after seven years of WL I have already saved most of the test signals I commonly need, but on-the-fly signal generation is better. I know I can do the signal generation and analysis in SM, but I'm not sure how well I can route, store, and playback incoming audio, that's the question.
WL has some great built-in meters and some that are terrible. I think the only thing I really like anymore in WL is its FFT, which is really good, especially in 7. Otherwise . . . I like my SM tools better.
So I have written a few VSTs that give me the analysis functions I need (a nice configurable o-scope, for example, and a better spectrum meter). But I can't easily apply them to different areas of WL. When you are outside of Montage you can only apply VSTs on the Master section, which means you can't on input, only on playback. That's a major limitation. You can't run simultaneous analysis on different tracks without assembling them all into a Montage and inserting the VSTs on each track--that takes time and a lot of screen real estate. You can't use the native analysis tool inside Montage at all, only on the Montage playback.
Sorry for the rant 😠 I do like WL for music production, it's blissfully free of anachronistic mixing concepts other DAWs seem wedded to. Although what I'd really like is a DAW that mixed based upon a modeling of tracks placed in a virtual physical space, like arranging a stage plot . . . someday I will have to write that . . .
infuzion ·
I use WL4 on my XP, but it doesn't work on Win7 at all. I like the meters there also. Lately I use Ableton Live for (pre)mastering.
Routing audio is solvable: http://www.virtualaudiostream.com/ & there is another somewhere....
I have to PM you sometime; I know peeps in the movie industry out there in NC. I guess it is becoming what Denver tried to be once.
mshilarious ·
Seems this is still a limitation:
Multiple Ins and Outs in .exe
So I'm looking at a VST host or rewire app like you posted 😕
I can route ASIO just fine while running inside SM, but the .exe doesn't seem to have any clue what to do with the ASIO inputs 🙁
infuzion ·
mshilarious wrote: I can route ASIO just fine while running inside SM, but the .exe doesn't seem to have any clue what to do with the ASIO inputs 🙁
Tried the newish Audio Selector module? If that that does not work, then that is a bug.
trogluddite ·
Having access to all your ASIO inputs/outputs is possible from a .exe - I am very drunk right now, will post a more coherent response later...
infuzion ·
trogluddite wrote: I am very drunk right now, will post a more coherent response later...
Feeling more like your profile pic? 😉
BTW, don't program ASM while not being coherant; might get a BSOD.
mshilarious ·
Ah, I wish I was healthy enough to get drunk 🙁 Last week I seemed to pick up something called Bell's palsy (it's not catching I don't think), the meds for that are steroids that have me messed up and bad for my already bad stomach . . .
Anyway, the selector does the same thing as the Audio menu in the .exe, which is it lets me select a driver. When I select ASIO (Steinberg card/driver), it routes the first input (out of 20 available) to all inputs I coded in the .exe, and none of the other inputs go anywhere.
Next I was checking out the Wave Read/Save modules--am I missing something, or is there no mono-->mem module? Maybe there is something I don't understand about how Mem Create/Wave Write is supposed to work . . .
trogluddite ·
Using multi-I/O in an exe export works a little differently to VST's.
If you export like a VST, i.e. a module with input and output connectors, the .exe will always default to mono-in, stereo-out.
However, if you put your driver primitives inside the module (no external output links), the complete driver selection system will be exported inside the .exe. you can then set up any driver GUI that you like.
If you put your own driver selector on your GUI, it's a good idea to disable the menu bar in the options when you export the .exe.
The only limitation that I'm aware of, is that there is no way to count how many inputs the driver has - so there's no way to make an .exe adapt automatically if the driver has less inputs than you need.
You might be interested in the schematic I posted HERE - it contains all the parts for a pop-up window for driver and i/o selection, which also saves your current setup to HDD and auto-loads it at startup.
mshilarious wrote: mono-->mem module?
It is hiding!
Open Options->Advanced, and tick the box 'Show R&D Components" - you will find a whole load of new modules in your toolbox (shown with a pink background). Although they are 'R&D',all of the modules I've tried seem perfectly stable.
When you create a 'mem' to write into, you can choose mono or stereo - but beware of the size input, it is the amount of memory, not the number of samples!
Each sample requires 4 bytes to store a value - so for mono multiply the number of samples by 4, for stereo multiply by 8.
mshilarious wrote: Bell's palsy
Hope you get well soon!
infuzion ·
Maybe use:
http://savannah.nongnu.org/projects/traverso/
http://www.samplitude.com/en/products/p ... .1782.html (I've read about a few ProTools users switching over to Samplitude family)
mshilarious ·
Ooh that's brilliant, the .exe works perfectly now. This tool is not for public consumption, so I'll just hardwire my ASIO I/O as required. Thanks! 🙂
Now, onto my next project, which involves finally struggling with the GUI primitives in order to draw an interactive room simulator . . . as much as I love the coding environment, it does have one major disadvantage over the old-school typing method: repetitive stress injury from mousing! I have to carefully allocate my right-hand functionality between mousing and soldering 🙁
trogluddite ·
mshilarious wrote: repetitive stress injury from mousing!
I've found life so much more comfortable since I started using a trackball. Really takes the strain off your wrists, as you can do everything with just your fingertips - especially once you get used to 'throwing' the ball, and letting its inertia take care of the big moves. It's also a lot easier than a mouse to stick it on your lap for a quick change of posture to avoid getting 'hunched geek shoulder'.
If you fancy trying it, be sure to get one with a nice weighty ball that sits on proper 'ball bearings' - there are some poor quality ones out there that feel as if you're using the dispenser from a 3 month old roll-on deodorant can.
infuzion ·
trogluddite wrote:
mshilarious wrote: repetitive stress injury from mousing!
I've found life so much more comfortable since I started using a trackball.
I've been using trackballs on PCs for about 10 years now, ever since using one on a Sun Sparc station. They really do help alot, & you can put it on your lap & not wear out your arm/wrist there also. Companies make them only in a few-year spurts, so if you find one you really really like, buy an extra or 2.
http://www.trackballer.com/
mshilarious ·
It's the buttons and mouse wheel that get me moreso than the mouse moves, so I think a trackball would be the same. I'll give one a try if I can find a bluetooth trackball.
infuzion ·
mshilarious wrote: It's the buttons and mouse wheel that get me moreso than the mouse moves, so I think a trackball would be the same. I'll give one a try if I can find a bluetooth trackball.
The thing is with a trackball, is that you only move your thumb very small amount, or perhaps your finger (depending where the ball is located).
Not BT, but is wireless: (I'd prefer wired due to 2.4GHz congestion, but oh well)
http://www.trackballer.com/2011/02/03/r ... ths-later/
mshilarious ·
I'm thinking this might be the way to go for anything that involves drawing lots of line (PCB/schemo CAD, SM, etc.) except it requires Windows 7 which I have no intention of adopting . . . 😠
mshilarious wrote: I'm thinking this might be the way to go for anything that involves drawing lots of line (PCB/schemo CAD, SM, etc.) except it requires Windows 7 which I have no intention of adopting . . . 😠
http://www.logitech.com/en-us/mice-poin ... vices/8417
You need a "drawing tablet" then. But you still have to move your wrist.
The new audio drivers in Win7 rock BTW. But Win8's faster boot time & other improvements will rock better.
mshilarious ·
That's OK, my wrists are not injured, just my right hand fingers . . . and I write left-handed, so that would definitely help 🙂 I can solder for hours without left-hand strain, so a stylus is not a problem.
I'm afraid I am hopelessly stuck in the past as far as software. I have Win7 at the office and hate it; I hate Office 2007 even more. I used to be a very skilled Excel user; now I can't find much of the stuff I knew how do to. Yeah, I can search for it, but what used to take me seconds takes a few minutes now 😠
And so I didn't like WL7 either . . . I fit in pretty well with SM, 32 bit is fine with me . . . gimme blue MIDI timing and I'd be happy pretty much forever.
Oh, and port Flowstone to MCUs 😉 I actually thought briefly about doing a Windows Embedded product yesterday, but the hardware is too expensive for my purposes.
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